NY approves advisory study commission on slavery and reparations. What's next?

Gov. Kathy Hochul this past week signed legislation creating a state commission to study the possibility of making reparations to descendants of enslaved New Yorkers.

For supporters, getting the controversial, long-debated measure off the ground might be the easiest part of the process. Final legislative approval for the study panel came in June; it wasn’t until the bill signing on Tuesday that Hochul as much as hinted at her support for an inquiry.

The law calls for the creation of a nine-member commission to study slavery's history and lasting effects in New York. A key task: recommending “appropriate remedies and reparations” for descendants of enslaved African people, including changes to state laws and policies.

All Things Considered host Sean Carlson recently discussed the commission, and the work ahead, with State Sen. James Sanders Jr., a Democrat from Queens and sponsor of the reparations law.

A transcript of their conversation follows. It has been lightly edited for length and clarity.

Carlson: So I think a lot of folks might hear this and say, “wait a second, New York was part of the Union. Slavery was a decidedly Southern thing. Why is this inquiry even necessary?"

Sanders: Well, New York played an outsized role, an oversized role in slavery. New York City, at one point, had more slaves than any city in what became the U.S., with the exception of Charleston, South Carolina. New York City or New York State, since we had the financial capital, we insured all of the moving parts of slavery.

We insured the slaves. We insured the cotton that was coming up and the tobacco, the corn, all of those markets, we insured them. Not only did we do that, we banked them. We banked the profits. We lent the money to them. We insured the ships that were sent out not only to get the slaves, but to bring the goods to England.

In fact, it could be argued that without New York State, slavery as it was would not have lasted as long as it did.

So, what remedies and reparations are you thinking? I imagine there are options other than cash, right?

Well, there have to be options other than cash. Now, I must concede that the remedies will be put together by a group of nine people, three chosen by the governor, three chosen by the state Assembly and three chosen by the state Senate. And these nine wise people will get together and look at: Is it a question of policies that must be changed? Is it a question of taxes that must be changed? Is it a question of money? Is it a question of law? Or is it some combination of all of these things that must be changed to allow the African American population in New York State to have an equality of opportunity in New York state. Right now, that group is falling further and further behind.

Republican Senate leader Rob Ortt had some strong words after the bill signing on Tuesday. I'll give you a quote here. He said he's “confident this commission's recommendations will be unrealistic, will come at an astronomical cost to all New Yorkers and only further divide our state.” How do you respond to that?

Well, that type of thinking is why the Republicans have gone from having a 40-year reign in the State Senate to being a super minority in the state. This idea, this thinking of a zero-sum game, that there’s no way that anyone can bring equality except by someone else losing -- we Democrats don't see it that way.

We believe that there are real possibilities of being able to bring justice without taking away from anyone.

Reparations themselves remain fairly unpopular to all but Black Americans, based on polling by Pew. So as a matter of politics and practicality, do you see a path forward here?

Well, I will remind you that support for reparations for the Holocaust were even lower in Germany at the end of World War II. Eleven percent of Germans agreed to reparations at the end of the Holocaust. Now, 95% of Germans agree that reparations were needed and justified.

So, people can grow. And it's more of a question of education. I would argue where we have to go to good Americans, good New Yorkers, and lay out everything to them and say, “here is an issue of justice, an issue of fairness, an issue of equality.” This group has been put so far behind that they cannot catch up and have a chance at the American dream.

And if we all believe in equality, then there are steps that we have to take to ensure it. I also will remind you that the polling in support of reparations is actually increasing. And when you look at different age groups, you will find that younger New Yorkers, younger White Americans are far more open to this idea than older people are.